With friends like these…

with narratives starting to…

I really don’t like the vibes coming off Saliba’s contract negotiations and fans who should know better telling people not to worry we’ve got the option to extend for a year don’t help when its not true.

What signal does it send to targets that a young player who’s going to be one of the best in the world doesn’t want to play for Arteta?

As bad as Seville are at playacting Roma are worse. It really is farcical. Have to hope the Spaniards win this, Mourihno’s brand is toxic( though undisputedly effective,in the short term at least). This is so far from the football I watched as a chap that it’s like a different sport.
KP,
There was an absolutely brilliant documentary on Kevin Moran the other night and how he won two all Ireland football medals with Dublin before joining utd. Bryan Robson said that he actually counted in one season alone Moran had 52 stitches. They sure don’t make them like that anymore! That was the game I fell in love with.

Marc,
We won’t know the truth of Saliba’s relationship with Arsenal/Arteta for a long time,he won’t reveal the truth until he has or is near retired. My suspicions are similar to yours. These footballers today (and managers) all seem to be afflicted with hubris on a classical scale. There’s little doubt the relationship between himself and Arteta would have been a challenging one. The question,regardless of who was in the right/wrong is whether that relationship is going to affect his next move. I know ultimately money talks but I doubt we can offer him something that other big clubs can’t, so we have to hope he wants to stay,and that’s where I’d be worried……

Almunia

I’m not so sure – I have a feeling that Saliba thinks Arteta is a cunt of epic proportions and without saying it directly will infer or leak comments / stories once he’s out the door.

Unfortunately I think we’re going to find out much sooner than any of us would like (obviously what Saliba thinks of Arteta not that Arteta’s a cunt of epic proportions anyone with half a brain already knows that!).

Marc,
When you see the dearth of cb’s at the moment losing Saliba would be a bitter blow,impossible to replace almost. But also it would send a terrible message if a young player like that started speaking ill of the club. With utd ( and england) still playing maguire, Chelsea reliant on 67 yr old thiago silva,pool unable to find VVD a partner and now he is fading,the competition for any emerging talent in that position would be particularly fierce. He is not a player we can afford to lose. Returning to Gabriel and White as 1st choice would be depressing for me.

Almunia

Agree 100% losing him will be a massive failure of our management team.

I can hear the excuses being prepped already.

Marc & Almunia-I certainly get why some have compared him to VVD, due to his efficiency of movement, his angles when recovering, the fact that he moves faster than he appears to be and that he never seems to go into panic mode…now that doesn’t mean it’s a forgone conclusion that he’ll ever get to that level, but if he lands at a “big” club, where defenders have a tendency to even look better, like Real, Barca or even PSG, due to the level of competition in Ligue 1, we’re going to look like even bigger tools…if we can’t tie him down it will be just another self-inflicted wound brought about by the incompetence and short-sightedness of our novice manager

I’m starting to fully grasp the reason why Ozil was such a divisive figure in the history of our club…when you really examine our transfer history, at least since our move to the Emirates, he was the only player of seminal importance, to a championship level side, that we ever plucked who was still functionally within his prime playing years…now of course things didn’t end well, but I definitely understand why some were so quick to come to his defence even when logic suggested otherwise

so if we really want to rewrite our organizational narrative we need to be poaching big time players from big time clubs still in their primes…only then will we truly re-enter the conversation…now we might need to adopt a more Juve-like squad building model first by (1) acquiring some of the most highly touted players/prospects inside the PL and (2) showing that we’re serious about being European contenders for the foreseeable future by making a deep run in the CL

once we’ve started to establish ourselves as a team of import we will need to secure the services of an already established top world class talent, just to prove that we have the capacity to do so…in turn, other players of that ilk will start to have a rethink about us being a viable landing spot…let’s face it, we have world class facilities and the drawing power that invariably comes with being located in a world-renowned city, so this isn’t an unreasonable ask, if we get our shit together…furthermore, the fact that a bit of the shine has worn off some of the clubs who have dominated for the last 10+ years should help our cause, if we act fast, as our realistic window is 3 years

what we can’t do is sell any of our best and brightest young talents, unless we’re receiving a readymade star of no lesser value in return, or miss this rather fortuitous period of flux, here and abroad, while we wait for our managerial duo to learn the ins and outs of their respective crafts…think about it, GD Inter Milan is in a CL finals and in the semis they faced the very team that the oft-times unjustly maligned Gazidis built

on a side note it appears as if United has agreed personal terms with Mount…let the games begin

Morning all
I think the Saliba situation is a multi faceted one with such complexity of tumultuous feelings from Saliba’s side and Arteta’s stubborn make up of always being right. The lad was absolutely shit on by Arteta from a great height just after he’d lost both parents at 19. Nothing else needs to be said. If I were Saliba and his agent I’d say these are my demands if The Arsenal is not a big enough club to match them, I’m off.

Then sit back and wait for their answer in the time frame Saliba’s agent had issued.

It doesn’t matter how good a negotiator is when you don’t have the leverage, and their is ill feeling in the negotiations even if unsaid, then there will be no room for maneuvering. Saliba has been far more the mature human in all of this and Arteta looking sheepish wanting to make amends to such outlandish treatment Saliba received from Arteta.

A&E have taken the whole thing public where we are seeing stories of Saliba’s ‘Staggering’ demands in the Mirror who does a lot of Arsenal’s story bidding. How does the Mirror know they are staggering? Not from Saliba’s camp. There’s news chum in the waters and that is what The Arsenal are these days fodder for the reporters to play games for each side but I expect Saliba to waste little time protracting decisions when other big clubs are circling.

The notion that forwards get more than defenders is so old school it’s too ridiculous to even discuss. A player is worth what he is worth to the team. Saliba is a future captain for any side and one of 4 top alpha/elite players we’re lucky to have: Martinelli, Saka, Ode and Saliba who have all yet to hit their prime.

Only Arteta would deem Saliba isn’t worth the same as Saka etc.

I have no idea how this is going to play out but to be having such a public contract display before the TW even opens is not good optics at all because complete change in our TW dealings is necessary after last season’s dire picking off City’s ‘B’ listers who couldn’t offer us a complete season and proved why they were City’s also rans who we need to see on.

It seems Arteta’s man management has not improved one iota where it’s likely we’ll see one of the best RCB’s in the world play for another club.

Here’s how a big c club acts: it pays £200K+ bonuses a week to keep Saliba for the next 6 years. Barring a bad injury I see noting standing in Saliba’s way to be the best there is. If Saliba goes then Gabby has to go, too, because Gab’s without Saliba is a train wreck waiting to happen. Gab’s falls apart never wise.

The big club goes to the press and humble brags about Saliba and how we were happy to meet the demands of an elite player in the making. Far better optics and the press is used the right way.

Is Groundhog Day about to hit out TW again?

TRVL
One pice of news had me laughing this morning is that Manure are going to pay Maguire off to the tune of £10m. Maybe Arteta will see Maguire as Saliba’s replacement.

I thought that one of the reasons why Saliba was loaned back to France at a time when he was mourning family deaths was Arsenal understood that Saliba would benefit from being back in his homeland during a difficult time. Interesting how interpretations can differ!

Before dumping down on Arsenal’s transfer dealings, we should probably wait to see how this TW unfolds. One aspect of being a ‘big club’ is being in CL offering CL wages – tick. If Saliba signs, we’d have got all our ‘Crown Jewels’ extended – big tick. Signing a coveted transfer target(s) – to be decided! Properly challenging for PL – small tick. CL later stages- to be decided.

Bob,
Enjoy Lords today,don’t be afraid to give the boys in green some verbal backing,they’ll need it!

Bob
No one is dumping down on the club and it’s not about CL wages, £200+K is par for the course for top players and Saliba is a top player bordering elite. What do we do? Insult him with a derogatory offer and then play it out in the press.

The club is dumping down on itself. As you say let’s see how this plays out.

Tony, there is a time to get disgruntled by transfer outcomes when they are resolved.

Considering an unsubstantiated offer ‘insulting’ during negotiations is a little premature. I imagine Saliba and his representatives are expecting an extremely sizeable raise and Arsenal are having to tread carefully as it has repercussions on the wage negotiations throughout the squad.

Almunia, I might give them some verbals by the afternoon as the alcohol takes its toll but I’m in the Upper Tier so they might fall short!

Bob
We’ll see and hopefully it will work out. I try to keep out of TW’s, but Saliba is someone I have a lot of respect for and seems to have good advisors around him. He has been vocally prudent with his comments throughout, and his talent is worthy parity with Saka. I’d say Saliba is the bigger talent, but that’s just mho.

Enjoy Lords and the day, Bob.

Not so hopeful about the front office doing a stellar job this TW and just going by past record. Of the crown jewels, Ramsdale, really? the others with the exception of Martinellie were not Arteta signings, but his signings are up for loans or sale.

The two just don’t have the nous to spot talent and develop them or are unwilling to play youngsters. So we have to go out in the market and buy developed players, that is the definition of a checkbook manager for me. In addition Arteta does not attract players the way other managers do. that is why the Argentinian connection is not producing Emi will make sure of that and the same will be true if Guen has another extended conversation with Saliba.

Arteta fucked up that Saliba deal and the only option now is pay up and since it is not my money I am all in for it. Team will be stronger September 1st but where it will go and how far, not that thrilled because of the present leadership.

Killroy-I’m firmly within your camp when it comes to your assessment of our underwhelming duo…I want so desperately to just chill and wait to see what develops, but it’s difficult to do so in light of what has transpired in year’s past…from the childish grudges that have cost us dearly from an asset management perpsective, to their inability to lure world class players to the Emirates, I’m deeply concerned that another cock-up is in the offing this summer

as to the former, we’ve not only paid players to perform elsewhere(Ozil, Auba, Lucas, Guendo…), we’ve likewise missed several opportunities to sell off others when their value was at their highest, like AMN, Leno, Eddie and even Nelson…furthermore, MA’s unrelenting stubbornness might just cost us a future starting Striker, Balo, and a potential generational CB in Saliba

as to the latter, we’ve been rather poor when it comes to landing targets of considerable import to others, like Locatelli, Vlahovic and Mudryk, among others…now you can argue that these players aren’t world class, at least not at this juncture, but the fact that we made a concerted push for each one and not a one donned the kit, speaks volumes about their drawing power…I might have been hypercritical about the Wenger’s latter days regime, but there’s no doubt in my mind that if he had done likewise the outcome would have been vastly different; keeping in mind that he would have never pursued any of them solely predicated on their respective price tags alone

so if we’re pursuing the Fresneda kid, the RB from Valladolid, so that White can tuck back inside and replace an outgoing Saliba, this would be a major setback, even if Tomi were available sooner than first expected

if we’re thinking of offloading Balo, simply to sign a less polished version, like Wahi from Montpellier, that would be a direct sign that our manager’s egoistic agenda takes precendence over the best interests of the team as a whole

if we sign Rice for a boatload of cash then try to shoehorn him into a more advanced position, like our hopefully soon departing Xhaka, that would be a potential mistake…not because he’s not better than Granit, as there’s no question that he’s in a different league, but because it makes infinitely more sense to bring him in as our primary holding midfielder, much like I’m sure Tuchel is planning should he beat us to the punch, then get someone far more offensively-minded for that particular advanced role

if we’re simply signing Nelson to avoid paying a transfer fee for any viable alternative, that could be a big mistake, especially if he was given a substantial raise and a 4 year term to boot

if we’re not loaning out Vieira, like what transpired this season with the hopefully soon to be departing Lokonga, simply to save both money and face, this could be problematic situation moving forward

if we’re only keeping ESR because our manager’s ghosting of him substantially hurt his market value, yet he’s not really planning to give him significant minutes in his best position, that would be another stupid mistake

if we sell Partey and don’t land Caicedo, then try to rely on a DM trio that includes Jorginho, Elneny and someone on a “free”, like Tielemans or Gundogan, that could cost us dearly against teams who pack their respective midfields, as none of the players mentioned are the kind of defenders that the pivot position oft-times requires

fuck me, this could be a long and stressful off-season!!

Killroy, sepárate the players from the manager. WhetherMartinelli was an Arteta signing is completely irrelevant, he was willing to sign on for the Arsenal. Making it about the manager is so limiting. Whether you rate Arteta or not, Martinelli was willing to sign on the dotted line, as was Saka.

Martinelli was not an Arteta signing he made his debut under Emery.

Saka may have been willing to sign on but he wanted a buy out clause (why is someone who’s so happy at a club making sure there’s a lifeboat?) we refused so the compromise was a shorter extension. As it stands we’ve got 2 seasons before we have to get him to extend again or sell. A star player who’s come through the youth system should be being tied down to 5 or 6 years not getting sticking plaster solutions.

Always looking for a negative…

I could counter “always failing to see the truth”.

What was incorrect in what I said other than you don’t like it?

Here is the reason why I am not exited for the upcoming TW when looking at Arteta’s past record.

Good players but other club’s rejects.
Ødegaard, Jesus but he is not the CF which he was bought for. Massive drop in performance after return, but does do Oscar winning dive performances.

Failed or unnecessary purchases
Ben White an OK player but lost value because we overpaid for him.
Vieira, don’t have any idea why €35m was shelled out for him, for the future? Then he should have been loaned out.
Zinchenko, squad player but is terrible on defense and needs to be moved to a different position or benched.
Ramsdale, should have never been bought Emi was our keeper to play.
Kiwior, not what I expected and didn’t cover himself in glory when he tied his boot.
Lakonga, Tavares absolute failures.

Marc, truth is good.

Martinelli signed a new contract, that’s what was importan not whether he was an Arteta signing originally. Saka signs on for 4 yrs but the focus is on, only four years which is explained as it’s one year less as Arsenal didn’t want a buy out.

Apologies if I go against the grain here at times but you surely don’t just want an anti Arteta stream.

As we are hopeless at negotiating expect close to top price paid for Rice with £100m to buy and £300K+ a week.

Can’t see that fitting in with our wage structure, can we? So then, what is Saliba worth to us – our best defender by a country mile?

I’d prefer Caicedo & Mitoma for what we’re going to spend landing Rice.

Bob,
Any chance of you doing a bit of a rain dance there?

Tony

Wouldn’t be surprised at all.

I wouldn’t put my house on Ireland avoiding a substantial innings defeat. England might decide to get a ‘good net in’ today and even tomorrow.!